This! ...was Digital Watches Are a Pretty Neat Idea

One's Never Alone with a Rubber Duck

January 06, 2022 Jeff Lesnik & Bryan Campbell, a Froods for Thought production Season 1 Episode 5
This! ...was Digital Watches Are a Pretty Neat Idea
One's Never Alone with a Rubber Duck
Show Notes Transcript

Jeff and Bryan discuss, compare, and contrast the two versions of the same basic story represented in the last two episodes (Fit the Fifth and Fit the Sixth) of Primary Phase of the radio series and on the single LP, The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, Part Two: The Restaurant at the End of the Universe. Is one better than the other? Or, is there a nonexistent, perfect version somewhere in the middle?

This has been a Froods for Thought production.

Hey Brian how are you doing today I'm doing great Jeff how are you well I seem to have this pain and all the diodes down my left side H all right I get that the first thing I wanted to talk about in this podcast is something that came to me while listening to the last one we just did okay one of the points that I made was how I liked on the lp when they were doing the improbability calculation that Eddie was doing them in the background and the moment trillion was introduced and walked into the room he went probability complete like that was the last piece of data that push the improbability of everything that happened to Infinity but it wasn't because there was a whopping smack of probability that had not been calculated yet which is trillion owned the mice that happened to be on the Heart of Gold that went to magrathea so to me that is a whopping bit of improbability that had not been calculated yet and needed to be to push it to infinite so I liked the joke but it was a little bit early well that's interesting cuz there is something there that I thought I think it's in the radio show and I'm going to go back to last week's episode and say that one of the things that Trillium points out is that the entire process of them getting to magrathea has been manipulated from the beginning and if you recall a course the mice were with trillion all the way through the story so the mice in my opinion are the reason that they font stole the ship and the mice took the ship to magrathea that was their plan all they were manipulating trillion I can agree that it's part of the improbability cycle that they're going through but they actually intended to get there that was there they needed to get there in order to create the world and then the second you know Earth to they needed a ride to start the process so exactly so they were the ones manipulating zaphod and trillion to actually make that trip happen they did mention to me that all still has to figure into the improbability calculation of 100% in the radio series it was never completed but in the lp they did. And this was the final piece I like this joke and then I'm like no but it was it was wrong but that was last time this time we're going to be talking about primary phase part 2 so these are go to be the last two episodes episode of 5 + 6 the same basic stories did on the single LP of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy part 2 and again still wanted to do these simultaneously rather to do the LP on their own but this time though there's the section that did a total rewrite and is substantially different than the radio show but happens to be the same as the book so again I like that we're doing this together and I'm really on the fence of which of these two versions is better yes yes I think that we're looking at a situation where like you said before the last podcast that there may be some combination that makes it for a better story I'm still on the fence about which of the two versions I like better but the performances of the actors was much better in the radio series then it was on the lp this time the lp just seemed more like a reed and then a performance so I really like the way they did it in the in the radio Series right all right so we are going to start out with episode 5 and they start out this episode with a monologue and they're doing a history of the universe and everybody's search for meaning they threw in its much Ridiculousness as they possibly could from the universe being sneezed out by the great green arkel seizure to erase of small blue creatures with more than 50 arms who invented deodorant before the wheel and all of this was done just to remind us that two computers were built to find the answer and then the question of the meaning of life the universe Remind us that two computers were built to find the answer and then the question of the meaning of life the universe and everything funny because I've always wondered why he decided that the objective art of people the ones that created the great green article seizure w why they had 50 arms is that what he says 50 arms more than 50 arms right and that they were the first ones to create the spray deodorant yeah I would that make them think of a sneeze and sneezing out of of the world are the universe you know what and then I just sitting here thinking about it I'm thinking while the other probably had a pretty bad beating dunk so bad they were so sensitive to smell well that's why I called it as much Ridiculousness cuz I couldn't figure out what did the arkle seizure sneezing out the world to these little creatures with more than 50 arms I couldn't put a parallel but yes I think a lot of BO2 had texted to it so it in reviewing this information I was looking into it cuz I thought arkel seizure arkel seizure what what could you possibly be thinking of here in terms of of that phrase you know where did this phrase come from and I first thought it had something to do with the sneeze but then when I looked it up I found that the closest parallel seem to be Arc Circle seizure and people may be familiar with that because there are folks who suffer from this have their know their backs are arched in their feeder or are bent and I don't know whether he use this says of the precursor to a sneeze but that was the closest thing I could come to that so I'm not sure whether he use that as a reference to create this word but article seizure appears to be his own word yes I think that he just he found this term for this epileptic seizure and decided that he was going to create a fictitious being based on that because it sounds like a sneeze so it's really not a sneeze but it is it's another one of those like you said the word play that they use its tremendous right the last we knew they were all crouched behind a computer bank and it was being shot at in absorbing energy and then it explodes so the next thing that happens for the group is that they wake up or become aware of where they are and they have a little discussion about what it's like to be dead or in their their mind I think they're dead and then a gentleman walks up to them and starts speaking with them in comparing the the radio series and the lp like I said I really like the performances in the radio series the first difference that I've noticed is in the timing of the actors when they first arrived at the restaurant that you're talking about and they they meet this guy and it's this waiter he asks them if they want drinks he's ignored by everybody but if I remember is hearing something important and he wants to get back around to it right on the radio series see very clearly Sam to order drinks and there's no way they could have missed it on the lp right zaphod talks right over him in the middle of his sentence and you actually have to go back and listen carefully to actually hear him say drinks so it's very likely that they would have not heard them in both versions zaphod wants to go back Andre here with everybody just said to find out what he missed in the radio series trillion asks if it was about the chandelier she pointed out and they find goes to the waiter and then ask the waiter if you said something about drinks it's it's a little flat but on the lp it is actually done better they 5 asked each of them what they said trillion said they were standing up as opposed to lying dead see if it's like no no Arthur told him he said he thought it was more of an effort AP see if I size don't you wish you hadn't MN end in Ford said it was odd see if I was like yeah shrewd football then he says that leaves a little weird fellow and the waiter asks me speak to me and that's when he finds out about the drinks right after that's when they fought says So exactly so there's there is so much more that helps us get to know who these characters are and and reinforces the relationship each of them half so again the LP for me has the better writing where they have they've expanded on the original idea that they started within the radio series which shows the progression that eventually becomes the book I talk about the lp having better scripting but the radio series having better performances and here is where I noticed it really for the first time the waiter said that after drinks the universe would explode for their pleasure they still don't know where they are you at in Ford's like what type of drinks do you serve here and the waiter said that Ford misunderstood and forth like I hope not for me for delivers both of his lines better in the radio series than on the lp they find out the red Milly way switch is the restaurant at the end of the universe and they describe it and we are all told all of the impossible things about eating there then they tell us the advertising slogan that they use which is if you've done six impossible things today why not rounded off with breakfast it Millie ways I'm not sure how I feel about that whole it's like it's making fun of itself for writing something so ridiculous the only thing that I liked was that you could deposit a penny in your time and then by the time you got to the restaurant the compound interest pay the exorbitant cost of the meal that that is the one thing that was not impossible but the whole meeting yourself and all of that that was a little bit kind of strange right right yeah that's a little bit of a stretch in the living that I've always thought was odd and I can't quite figure this out but they do say breakfast bothers me that they say breakfast at Millie ways because to me if you're going to go and they even mentioned little later on of course that they can go to the Big Bang Burger Chef for the you know beginning of the universe and you would think to me. At least I would that if you're going to the beginning you would have breakfast at them when they're talking about the meal as it expands in the book and stuff it's definitely more dinner like the other thing I thought was interesting and if we talked a little bit about this actually in the wrap-up of last episode when we talkin about what day is it and I thought back a little bit about that because at one point I think they're circling the planet of magrathea and Trillium says it's about to become Dawn on the planet and then later Arthur relates to he's relating to Marvin how incredible the sunsets yes were cuz they're 2 sunsetting in in the west are well we will soon as the West in this particular case I wonder you know what wood is the day that much cost a sense of whether they're in the same day or where they're at I always think it's weird because well I'm sure we're going to get into the whole concept of Multiverse and and that kind of thing so let's just roll along as for your Dawn and your son set it could all be perspective absolutely when you're orbiting a planet you're going to you could watch it on but depending on where you land you can watch the sunset so it is theoretically possible to see both of them minutes apart right except that they're orbiting the planet when she mentions Dawn and Arthur is on the planet while he's while he's seeing Sunset argue about this people when they're looking at the planet from the other side of the sun while they're orbiting it they can watch the sun emerge and they can call that Don because the sun is merging from behind women and then as they Circle the planet and land they land in a place on the planet just before the sun sets yes that's clearly what they've done one of the things that I really liked in this is that they include this little piece with Ford trying to explain how many ways works and how they're going to survive the end of the universe by being in a Time bubble like anybody who has ever explained anything in a restaurant he starts arranging all of the spoons in the forks in the drinking glasses Sunglasses to better demonstrate what he's talking about and it all goes wrong people are mad that they're taking his fork and he knocks over a glass but I don't know if I've ever been in a restaurant with somebody his explain something Font that somebody had to explain something without lining up forks and spoons that's the way it works and like any big event or some kind of like a sporting event they always have groups and so he starts doing the acknowledgement of all of the different groups will commands a big shout-out to the group of minor deities from Asgard and there's like a Ruckus over there nope he mentions a hammer right well that refers to Thor and Thor's not a minor deity from Asgard I don't like that there's a hammer in the in the radio series our is just a Ruckus and he's like I'll that hurts but they do say minor deities from Asgard and he mentions hey is that your hammer or something like that, but you're forgetting the reference to scale your of course this is the universe you know that they're talking about and if you think about it those Gods if they existed existed for the planet Earth and the Earth no longer exists so are they made your way of thinking. Another group is the young conservatives from Sirius B which is the dog star and in the radio series they do a much better job of making barking and dog noises were you actually know that their dogs and then there's quite a bit of poking fun at the Believers of the second coming of the great prophet zarquon and those were a lot of cheap jokes at the Believers expenses who turned out to be right yes 8 seconds is it before or 12 seconds before here is where Marvin phones them at their table and they finally discover that Millie ways is built on the planet macrophilia when Arthur says that they have traveled in time but not in space zaphod having no patience for anything Arthur ever says shuts him down immediately and the waiter says your monkey has it right it seems that everybody everywhere he goes makes fun of him for his evolutionary history so of course he says to the waiter who are you calling a monkey and then again for me the radio series did a much better job of portraying that line yes yes they get a phone call from Marvin and there's a little it interchange with the waiter and they're surprised that they even get a phone call but it turns out that Marvin has been waiting for them for some millions and millions of years because he never left the planet when they went ahead in time as they are leaving the table but one of my favorite jokes in the radio show with this on this episode is when Arthur says what about my pears going I'm guessing there are three pairs that would be appropriate it's so subtle and they don't hardly even talk about it so I don't even know I know if you would catch it not knowing right I guess you just mentioned once I don't know how this fits in better let me try this one of the things he mentioned they talk about a cereal box where they use the cereal box to outline the well outlined the details of the universe and one of the things he talked about is the banking industry and the exchangeable currencies that are available and if they did they mention the right antique Pew the play The Impossible beads and other one the altarian dollar right and they said that the altarian dollar had just become D valuated and here they say they talk about the the Pew exchange rate of 6 ninjas to 1 Q was certainly easy to understand but of course of Minge is a large rubber coin that 600 ft 600 miles on one side and banking people stay but they they won't deal with the ningi cuz it's spilling Small Change I've got this feeling small change but it's a giant rubber coins 600 miles on each side I like that line I thought was pretty funny Rubber coins 600 miles on each side I like that line I thought was pretty funny you don't forget about that watches and safe and the others that was my Pinterest you were talking about Marvin being stuck there literally until the end of time and when Julian was talking about everything that they have been through including being blasted she says 576000 years but it's got to be 576 million years Through Time Marvel's like I right for you I had to go the long way around and of course they're well Marvin is there that's when he makes the comment that he can read the brain waves cuz we were talking about the question that the question being in Arthur's mind and he tells everybody that he could reach the brain waves and he knows the question and of course just like you mentioned before with the parallels between the TV and drama and all that kind of stuff they keep delay he keeps delaying until the answer until something else happens in the course the whole group goes on and the he makes this cuz comment I can't I could tell you weren't really interested every chance to tell them yes but there's also this change in this particular part where they start talking about the book again this is where the story got a total rewrite let's talk about the first version so we'll talk about the radio version first and then we'll go back and do a couple of changes that they made for the lp that is in the book last episode you were mentioning how important Marvin is into the whole hitchhiker's Universe in Bolton versions we listen to they are reunited with Marvin and Marvin help them steal the ship which was just about to talk about but when they first got there they were all so happy to see Marvin again which seems strange because they were totally sick and tired of him when they abandoned him on my magrathea so for him billions of years have gone by but for them it's just been moments so I'm sure that Marvin was on the Heart of Gold when they stole it he's not been a companion of theirs for very long know they stole the ship he stole Marvin right along with it right Marvin was part of the ship's complement he was one of the serious cybernetic robots that was part of the Heart of Gold ship why do you think they went from hating him so much they abandoned him I paragraph Thea to being so happy to see them when they were reunited it's a good question I really don't know I just felt like I guess it's kind of make some continuities maybe that that's the only thing I can think of is like you know they've been thrown into this relation and they're like oh wait a minute what the heck's going to happen next and they're like all look one of our old friends maybe we can make all of this work after all item I don't know that seems to be the only logical think I could think of we got two different theories stuff the one being the Practical one is that Marvin was a very minor character who tested very well and the writers decided wait we need to do more with Marvin because he's the one everybody likes the other thing is the last being in the world or the universe that they expected to run into at that restaurant because of its whopping improbability would have been Marvin so just the sheer fact of Marvin being there made it exciting to them but I just found a very disconnect between how how much they hated them and how happy they were to hear that he was at the restaurant so now we're going to talk about stealing a ship they meet Marvin who's in the car park and Ford and Arthur are just admiring all of the ships that are parked there and they find this black one that is so black you can hardly even see it and it's frictionless and they decide they want to steal it so they get Marvin to help steal the ship in the radio series the first version they've stolen and Admiral's Flagship and the race of beings are rapidly evolving creatures they wanted to find out who these creatures were so they they asked the book The Hitchhiker Scription part of the description said that if they were at lunch and one of them couldn't reach coffee spoon it would evolve into something with longer arms but that was probably incapable of drinking coffee now Arthur Goes a really great joke because as these creatures are evolving and we're going to I want to talk a little bit about that whole scene to the Admiral had evolved into a chair that they were using and trillion look at the chair and commented that she would prefer a chair with longer arms Arthur said but would probably be incapable of drinking coffee and nobody seemed to get the joke how could further tell a joke that went over everybody's head oh gosh I don't know what that scene was pretty funny the one the one I mean I don't know if you're going to go right on into what goes on as they that chair continues to mutate or go back over some other go back over the details of the of the evolution of the chair so to speak so do you want to do that while they are in the ship they're communicating with the they are the flagship so they're communicating with the rest of the fleet and they don't understand why even though three of them have shown their face on the monitor why the rest of the fleet hasn't recognized that there is a problem and of course then that's when they realized that the mutations of the creatures are there expected to be different every time you look at them and when Trillium is looking the commander of the fleet she mentions that the commander look like a pair of size 9 Chukka Boots of the line that Arthur again I think it's our how did you know they were secrets you don't get an answer but I still think that's pretty dang funny yes it is something else that I found hysterical is that when The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy book that they were listening to about the description of that race of creatures the rest of the universe words not evolving like they were and they refer to them is filthy rotten stinking same Wings on stinking same Wings was now evolving into the ravenous bugblatter Beast of trial and I think a vogon grand cuz they were calling back align from the first episode in the description of Ogontz right right getaway in the Escape pod and that they noticed that the other Escape pod is gone so they cono we've just left them and there's nothing that we can do and then forward let's Arthur know that when you do somebody in space you don't talk about them and you just get blind drunk about them later the other 3 trillion zaphod and Marvin are presumably eaten by the ravenous bugblatter Beast of trawl that was my bugblatter Beast of trawl imitation actually it would have been that Admiral who evolved into the bugblatter Beast impression that's that's correct in that exchange Marvin says I just want to die so that's just letting you know that he's lived for millions of years in one place waiting for these guys to come back so and I think even lost an arm and then the later on right before we cut to the forward and Arthur you can you can hear it in the radio show just just kills me it is overpowering some of those subtle little Ford and Arthur get separated on the radio series but the lp is totally different and for this we're going to jump back to the restaurant cuz it's a scene in the restaurant that we didn't talk about cuz it wasn't in the radio series and that is Ford going up to talk with this rock star named hotblack desiato do you want to talk about that scene I don't have too many notes on it except apply to have OneNote on it so forward walks up the hot black and he starts talking to him and he's basically a rattling off of my Why do have OneNote on it so forward walks up to hot black and he starts talking to him and he's basically a rattling off a monologue cuz there's no response from hot black and at one point he says. Black and you said you didn't want to be a star because you despise the star system I thought that was a pretty good Line This is a man systems complex got this bodyguard in The Bodyguard to me had the best lines he's like a kid who are you from long ago or whatever he's like well I'm hot black bodyguard and I'm here to protect his body and I'm not here to protect your body so you better remove it before it gets damaged that Sammy said everything you needed to know right I'm kind of at a loss because I'm not sure which of these two versions I like better I know that the book goes on to work with the hot black scene and of course it does give some foil for 4 to make some jokes and and the ship but I kind of like the way the Apple Flagship seen works out better than I like the way the pot black ship works out like I mentioned in the beginning I'm on the fence of which of the two versions is better I think they could have with the Admiral's Flagship thing and it would have been great but do you have a hot black I'm not sure why they went with it they're a lot of things that I like about it but I don't know if it needed to be that big of a change again they steal a ship identical ship to the one that the Admiral had but this time it's hot blacks and it's his stunts you so when 4 tells Arthur that the ship they are on is the stunt ship and that they're going to crash into the sun Arthur says maybe there is something you can do with your towel if you were a fan of the radio series back then and had not yet read the book and also listen to this to play at home there's there's no mention of the towel this is the only audio version of towel that has appeared it's very very important in the book but it's little throat align with no reference here and I just wondered if you had caught that I can't I can't I caught the reference when I heard it and I thought to myself the same thing it's interesting because I didn't notice it in the lp did you this is the lp is not in the radio Series so it's in it's in the lp but but not in the radio series yet right and I was trying to think back I don't think like you said there were any other references to the towel or the use of a towel in the radio show or otherwise at all exactly so yeah I did find that back to be strange and I was just wondering how it got thrown in there possibly because it made the book in this was probably recorded after the book but if you only listen to the audio and never read the book it wouldn't make any sense yet do you think we need to find out because that seems to be a pretty glaring find out what depth are well we know that the the the radio show the least the beginning the radio show was in 78 in the book didn't come out till 79 to live there was only six episodes here and you would figure that these things are weekly or something like that so if the whole process went over course of six weeks we're not talking about the book so I don't know where the reference is the way I understand it in my head is that they did the radio series and then he wrote the book and then they did the re recording of the radio series for the lp but made changes that better match the book but they didn't add anything about the towel in the beginning of it they just have this one line near the end okay so that's that's how I could believe it happened so they're on the ship and this is another one of those sign reading things so they don't know what they're going to do they can't control the ship they're going to crash into the sun Arthur asks what does teleporter mean or whatever and they're like where do you see that and he's like well under the words emergency and I messed that up because I didn't write it down for emergency use only I think yeah and then over the sign out of order so there are two other signs in one is out of order but they determined that it isn't totally out of work it's just that you can't tell the teleporter where you want to go it's just going to be random and it can't be automatic somebody has to stay behind Teleporter where you want to go it's just going to be random and it can't be automatic somebody has to stay behind and operate it in the exchange Marvin did not volunteer he just sort of settle you expect me to sacrifice myself so you can save yourselves and then remember when he was being eaten in the other version he's like I just want to die but in this version should be happy to stay behind and crashing to the Sun but he goes a guilt trip on the table and from this point on 4 right we follow Arthur and Ford and we do not know what happened 2 trillion and zaphod or Marvin at least they leave them alive to make it easier to later include them in the Continuing Story correct forward and Arthur teleported on to another spaceship and again I see this is all like you were talking to the swirling field of improbability correct the vortex of improbability yeah the first thing they encounter is the cryogenic hold full of presumably dead hairdressers account Executives and telephone sanitizers very shortly after that again they are probably captured and escorted to the captain Arthur says why isn't anybody ever happy to see us but the captain is taking a bath and he's been taking a bath for three years right so they got escorted to the captain and my favorite part of this whole bit is that number two who has captured them and has them as prisoners is so excited cuz he's never had any prisoners before and he wants to interrogate them and the captain agrees to let him interrogate them and he's like ask them what they want to drink and he didn't like a drill sergeants screaming every question at them what ask him about like lemon or with ice and then forward asks about possibly getting some of those little cheesy crackers and like I'm the one asking the questions exactly is telling them the story about why they're they're on the ship and they are from the planet go go frensham go go frensham had a population problem and they decided to solve it by ridding themselves of a useless third of their population they built three ships all the thinkers and scientists went in to ship a and all the labourers and the people who actually do the work they put in ship see and everybody else all the middleman typing things in ship be then they only sent off ship be which included the advertising Executives in the marketing analysts and the telephone sanitizers when they're mentioning the group of people were put onto the be our guy just this is where they do specifically mention advertising account Executives and management consultants in Back to the first lines of the story we we mentioned earlier we're all of Arthur's friends are in advertising to live happy and productive lives until they were all wiped out by a very all wiped out by a very I am going to be incapable of saying shall I say Vera lent yes so I think I will just say and Brian what happened to the people of golga frensham well they were all wiped out by a variant what now disease brought on by a dirty telephone they were they were all wiped out by a virulent disease that was brought on by a dirty telephone very very necessary all right I'm not sure how much of that I'm going to end it out Leave It All To Me I'm going to leave a lot of it and I think I know you were going to get to it but I'm going to jump ahead here a little late night I just think it's so funny where the captain is course hitting his bath and he's trying to recall or tell the story and he says to Arthur and 40 says you know you already know what you're going to talk All by yourself then half the time you already know what you're going to talk and then of course when they're discussing the reason why the bjark seems to be the only one that was leaving they talk about the different disasters that were supposedly given in time to plan it of course then they go on to that little story about how those disasters got orchestrated but useless bloody Looney I knew there was a reason they were told varying stories about why the planet was doomed so it was going to be eaten by a giant space goat or the moon was going to crash into it the moon crashing into it to me that kind of sounds like 70s RVs similar stories well it happens to be coincidental a similar I don't know something like that a little taste of how inept the golden friendships are at creating a society they can't finish discovering fire because they need to decide how to Market it like do people want fire that can be fitted nasally and that was all because forward in his just exasperation told her to stick it up your nose and so but yeah they're also having difficulty discovering the wheel because they can't decide what color it should be if they're making documentaries about the dying off of the indigenous people there is a line in one of the version that says they need to stop selling them life insurance so I'm guessing life insurance salesmen are all part of the useless bloody loonies and the loneliness of command and the captain again still in his bath tells him not to stress that last thing all because one of my favorite lines right and what is he say ones never alone with a rubber duck my favorite line you don't forget about those digital watches in the safe in the end the late tell me about the rubber duck. They've also made leaves their currency but everybody is very rich but there is rampant inflation and I think he uses the example of 3 deciduous forests equal ships peanut so they decide to go through and aggressive defoliation campaign to help revalue the leaf and I'm the lp they even declare a preemptive war on a neighboring area if anybody ever happens to live there so now comes the big Cliffhanger question since the gold of friendship has landed on prehistoric Earth and all the indigenous caveman have died out the human race is now involved from the goal to French um's and not the original indigenous people so the program should have an air and whatever question that Arthur might have in his brain wave pattern is most likely incorrect they use the Scrabble board and just draw out random letters and they get the question what do you get when you multiply 6 by 9 so that leaves the question is the program the Earth was running to find the question corrupt or this question somehow the real question all right so next time Brian I think I want to continue on with the radio series rather than going to the actual book and we're going to do secondary phase which is episodes 7 through 12 excellent I look forward to it so say goodbye Brian goodbye Brian